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Podcast: Kelsey Toevs on Following your passion, channelling creativity, and riding without an ego.

Today on the podcast I got to chat with Kelsey Toevs. Kelsey is a professional filmmaker and photographer based out of North Vancouver. Growing up in Lynn Valley, Kelsey has been combining her passion for Mountain Biking, Snowboarding, and filmmaking since a young age.

When she met her longtime partner in crime, local free-rider Steve Vanderhoek, they combined forces and set out to help each other push their creative boundaries in the Mountain Biking scene.

With an impressive portfolio of work too large to list here, Kelsey has gone from filming Steve's stunts purely for fun, to working with Red Bull and Anthill Films - two of the biggest producers in the industry.

On top of this, her film ‘Ready or Not’ which features none other than Steve, Wade Simmons, and Brett Tippie won the 2023 Crankworx Dirt Diaries competition and inspired many with its creative storyline, humor, and jaw-dropping slow-motion sends. Durning the conversation we touch on:

  • What it is like to watch her husband risk everything from behind the lens.

  • How she comes up with creative concepts for films.

  • Her own journey on the bike.

  • How following her passion has led to some epic career opportunities.

  • And how riding without expectations or ego allows her to have more fun!

You can check out Kelsey's amazing photography work on her website, and follow her adventures on Instagram @toevs and YouTube @ktoevs A lot of her filmmaking projects featuring Steve Vanderhoek are posted on his YouTube channel, including the Dirt Diaries Ready or Not film - you can watch that here @stevevanderhoek1304

Listen here or by searching for ‘Grit with Wisdom’ on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube, or over on my website, and you can follow me on Instagram @the_mind_mountain

Happy trails - Jake Johnstone

Full Episode Transcript:

Kelsey Toevs

[00:00:00] Welcome to Grit With Wisdom. This is the podcast that delves deep into the inner psyche of mountain bikers from all aspects of our sport in order to discover the tools and the tactics that can help us have more fun out on the trails more often. Our aim here is to help you understand what it takes to push our own personal boundaries in the sport we love, from a mental and emotional perspective.

Today on the podcast, I'm sitting down after a killer lap of half Nelson here in Squamish with Kelsey Toves.

Kelsey is a professional filmmaker and photographer based out of North Vancouver. Growing up on the shore, Kelsey has been combining her passion for mountain biking, snowboarding and filmmaking since a young age. [00:01:00] When she met her longtime partner in crime, local free rider Steve Vanderhoek, they combined forces and set out to help each other push their creative boundaries in the mountain biking space.

With an impressive portfolio of work too large for me to list here, I'll just go ahead and list some of the more recent highlights, uh, including a full feature article in the Free Hub mountain bike magazine, along with the film Risk is Reward, which documents Steve's relationship with risk, both in his work as a firefighter and on the bike in his free time.

yeah, you were also awarded a place as a filmmaker at the Red Bull Formation, which is a female free ride event back in 2022. And more recently, your film Ready or Not, which features none other than Steve, Wade Simmons, and Brett Tippie won the 2023 Dirt Diaries competition.

Yeah. So with no further ado, welcome to the podcast. Nice. Yeah.

Thanks for having me. I'm stoked to be here. This is not a bad setup [00:02:00] with the fire, the coffee,

the rain. Podcasts have slowly got fancier and fancier as the weather gets colder. Yeah, totally. As the rain

came. I know. I was down to be sitting in the rain, just...

out, but I appreciate this a little bit more.

Absolutely. We just had a great lap down half Nelson. Um, I know it's one of my favorite trails always will be, but I'd love to know, like, why is it one of your favorite trails?

Yeah, to be honest, like I just, I like how like fun and flowy it is. Obviously you don't really get a ton of that on the North shore.

And so I feel like when I'm in. A flowy, fun, I don't have to think too hard about it, and I'm just like having a blast with the pals is when I'm truly just like having the best time and I'm actually getting like true enjoyment out of it. I struggle with the like steep technical stuff that bring, that comes with the North Shore because like I can ride it and it's fine and that's what I, you know, learned on.

It's more like I have to be engaged. My brain has to be on and it's like I can't [00:03:00] kind of get loose in the, Oh, I'm just having a fun time and I can laugh with my friends while I'm doing this or whatever. It's more like, okay, I have to focus on this. And then when I get to the bottom of the trail, I'm like.

Oh, my God. Yes, I didn't die. And so I'm like, I don't need to have that feeling all the time. So yeah, I, even though I can ride it all, I have the most amount of fun when I'm just kind of like flowing and whatever. It's just, it's, it's a good feeling. It brings me to like, feeling more like I'm snowboarding.

So I think that kind of is what brings more joy to, yeah, the trail and everything. So, yeah. I'm happy to hit it when I can.

Totally, yeah, I love that reason. It's almost like a bit of a treat, isn't it? To ride like a trail that's easy for us and just ride in that fun zone, like you say, rather than being maybe on the edge of your limits.

Exactly, and it's always, yeah, I feel like I'm just kind of like, okay, yeah, we're gonna go ride like Fifth Horseman. And I'm like, okay, there's this feature, I know I've done it, I can do it, okay, we'll do that one, and then on to the next one. And I'm like, okay, I've made it through that one. And it's just a little bit more, like, stressful.

And sometimes I just don't want to [00:04:00] feel stressed. I just want to feel like I can go as fast or as slow as I want and, and it's good. And it's, I always end up having a good time on that trail. So that's why I was like, eh, we'll just do this one. I haven't been on my bike in a while. So it was kind of good one to get into it


Yeah. Fantastic choice. Yeah. Awesome. And I'd love to talk a little bit about like, growing up on the North shore for you. I'm curious, like what came first? Snowboarding, mountain biking or photography?

Oh yeah. Um, Oh, photography, I guess. Um, Snowboarding, 100%. Snowboarding came first. Um, yeah, I grew up skiing.

Um, and then in grade 6, I took on snowboarding. Um, and then I did both for a while and then I just realized how much more fun snowboarding was. And so then I just kept I don't know, I dropped skiing sort of around high school and then snowboarded for so long, but then high school, I got into photography, did a photo class, and then that was kind of a hobby and then The filming kind of came out around the same time in high school.

Um, that was [00:05:00] when I met Steve and then I would just go out with my little. Camcorder and we'd go and film snowboard videos and have fun just like building jumps on grouse and and filming those and just making stupid videos And then we kind of then I got more into following Steve with his like going to dirt jumps and stuff like that And so I was just taking my hand at doing photos and videos there, but I didn't really like fully take off Like video and photo work for a while.

It was just sort of something I Had fun with occasionally I'd go out and but it was never like a full full passion of mine But snowboarding was and it was we were out Constantly all the time every weekend every weekday afternoon as much as we could Steve and I were out there snowboarding And I had a ton of friends in it.

So I was always up the mountain and So yeah, snowboarding definitely was my main passion.

Yeah for sure That's awesome and mm-Hmm, and like, what was it about snowboarding that kind of sparked your interest then and has [00:06:00] continued to this day?

It was just so fun. Like I really, everyone that I was out with, everyone was the same level.

So it was like, if you wanted to learn a new trick, you'd just go out and, and we would just spend hours and hours and hours just like trying to do this trick and, and everyone was learning the same thing and or some people were better at things. So then you'd kind of like. You know learn off of them and it was just fun to just like be up the mountain and I don't know just being in The snow and it was just so fun I don't know everyone that we knew was up grouse all of our friends every single person had a grouse pass So it was just you'd go up there by yourself You'd always run into people who were up there you'd never be never ride alone And so it was just kind of like where everyone hung out so and then eventually Steve got a job doing ski patrol up there So then it just was even more time up there.

Like I would just go up there because I knew Steve was working and then we became friends with all the ski patrollers and the mountain safety and the lifties and everything. So it was just like every single moment of our time was just spent up there. And snowboarding is just like, you just [00:07:00] feel like.

Free and it's so fun and cruisy and poppy and whatever. I don't know You just I feel like I can just never have a bad time on my snowboard. It's it's so fun.

Yeah, no bad days What a fantastic place to grow up. That sounds amazing.

I love it. Yeah, I would actually as I remember I went to cap for school for a little bit and I'd have this break in the middle of my day for like Three hours or three and a half hours or something And I'd bring my snowboard stuff to school with me and then in that break I would drive to Grouse, go up, do like, I don't know, two laps or something and then come back and I'd be back at my afternoon class because it was just like, I had the time.

Sure, I probably should have been studying. But no, I was in outdoor rec and tourism management so I was like, it kind of fits that I would just go and do this in between my classes. But, uh, it was the best. It was quick to go too and yeah, I couldn't get enough of it.

Only on the North Shore, hey?

Pretty much, yeah.

I don't know anywhere else that you could do that, but, I'm sure there are places, but

I don't know them. [00:08:00] Fantastic. And then, like, biking wise, is that something you kind of picked up later on in the piece after going out and creating these filmmaking projects with Steve?

Yeah, no, I had no interest in biking, like, that was fully Steve's thing.

I could care less about it. I didn't want to get into it whatsoever. Um, mainly when... I knew Steve, I only filmed him doing dirt jumping stuff, and so that's all I knew, and I was, I knew I wasn't going to get into that. So, I, uh, I didn't get into it until, I don't know, I want to say maybe I was like, later into my twenties.

Um, and it wasn't until a bunch of my friends got into it. Um, because I always just knew of it as like, no, it's a dangerous sport. I'm not going to have fun. No one that I know does it except for Steve and his friends. So, and I'm not going to go out with them. It was his thing. I didn't really care to do it.

Um, and then, yeah, one of my close friends, she was like, Kate, I've got into it. It's fine. You'll like it. Well, go out and we'll have a good time. And I was like, okay. And I borrowed, um, one of [00:09:00] Steve's friend's bikes. And it was this like super expensive bike, super nice. And I was like, well, I can't have a bad time on this.

This is going to be really good. And we went and rode bobsled, just me and my friend. And, um, I had the worst time. Like, I absolutely hated every bit of it. I, A, didn't know that you were supposed to stand on your bike when you rode it. I don't know why. I didn't put two and two together. And I was like, oh my god, yeah, right, you're not sitting on your bike going down the trails.

You're standing on your bike. And I don't know why this was, like, what I was thinking. But, either way, I figured it out. How I was supposed to stand on my bike and everything. Hated it. Almost died so many times. And then at the end of the trail, I was like, I don't need to bike. This isn't my thing. I don't want to do it ever.

And she was like, Okay, yeah, no, that's totally fine. And then I took a year off from it again. More of my friends got into it. And then, um, Yeah, and then eventually I was like, Okay, I'll try it again. Took out my, I just had like a 29 inch um, wheel, whatever, trail bike, like a gravel bike, essentially. Yeah, yeah.

And I was like, whatever, I'll just take it out. And we went with a big group of people [00:10:00] and the mood was good. The friends were good. The vibe was good, everything. And I was like, okay, I knew what to expect. I knew what bobsled was. So I just went down it and at the end of the thing, I was like, Oh my God, that actually was really fun.

Like it brought back the feeling of when I was snowboarding. And so I was like, okay, yeah, no, it's the friends you're with and the flowiness of it. And you know, the fact that when you're done the ride, you're just like in a good mood. And so I was like, okay, yeah, no, I like this. And so then, I don't know, two weeks later, I bought a bike and then just went from there.

Yeah. So that's kind of how I got into it. But I, yeah, like I said, it was Steve's thing. I didn't need to get into it. I didn't have any thought like, Oh, if I get into biking, I'll get to go with Steve. Because we had snowboarding, that was fine. Um, and so, yeah, he just, but he was great. Like he, I went out with him and he would teach me.

So well, he was so patient and it was really fun to go out with him. He always like, you know, said, you're not taking me away from a ride and you know, you're not, you're not [00:11:00] making it worse for me to go out riding just because I'm riding, you know, a chill trail or we're going slow or whatever. Um, it was just like nice to get out together and he's a really good coach.

So I just, I think I learned a lot quicker just because he took the time to coach me and everything. And then I just went out with a bunch of my other friends and stuff too. And yeah, it just kind of went from there.

That's such a cool back story. I'm sure it's cool for Steve as well to be able to go out on some of these chill rides, like we were kind of saying at the start of our conversation, sometimes it's nice not to be scared.

Totally, yeah,

like you said, you're like, oh yeah, no, it's good. I love going out with my friends who are just starting, because I'm like, cool, I don't have to push myself. We don't have to go, like, ride an early trail. We can just be comfy, and I can go as slow as they're going, and it's all chill, so, yeah, I appreciate those days too.

Yeah, totally. Oh, you mentioned in there, like, a little bit, Um, about your school at CAF, um, studying outdoor rec there. Was it these, these hobbies, like the snowboarding, the mountain biking, the photography, was it these kind of hobbies that led you into

studying that? [00:12:00] Um, not really. I did, I mean, like, sure, I, I liked snowboarding and it wasn't even like I was truly an outdoorsy person even when I got into that.

It was just because I couldn't find anything I wanted to do for school. Um, There was just no, like, I knew I didn't want to go to school just to go. I felt like that was just kind of like a waste of time for me. I knew I didn't want to go to business school and there was just nothing that was driving me to go for something specific.

So I took time off after I graduated. And I worked a bunch, and I had like a bunch of different jobs, and just trying to figure out what I liked and what I didn't like. And, um, my sister did the tourism management course at CAP, and so she really liked it, and so I was just like, okay, cool, I'll just go for that.

You know, she liked it, she learned a lot, and it seemed like a good course to do. So, I went and did that, and then it wasn't very long, but I made a lot of really good friends, and I learned a lot. Um, but I went into it [00:13:00] thinking... Um, you know, I'm never going to start my own business. I don't want to have employees.

I don't want to run my own thing. I want to work for somebody and, you know, that, that's going to be it. But of course, here we are, you know, however many later, how many years later and I have my own business and I work for myself and I have to do all this stuff. You know, I don't have employees, thank God.

But still, I was like, I could have taken so much of that knowledge from school and put it towards this if there wasn't such a big gap in between. But I'm like... Kind of pulling stuff of what I learned in school, but to be honest, it was just like, nah, I learned it, I graduated, and I left, and that was it, but No, I just, I did it because it was just something that kind of interested me at the time.

But, yeah, that was it, and then, yeah, never went back to school again after that.

Yeah, no, that's cool. I think a lot of life, well, drawing on my own experiences, you have to kind of try things. Yeah. All of the time you don't know and you have to just try something and then it's kind of... Totally, yeah. In that experience you'll come around like the long path and get to [00:14:00] where you are now.

Yeah, and that's how I ended up with photography was just that I tried, you know, did, went to school and then I... Went and worked a bunch of different jobs like from all over the spectrum of things and I just couldn't find something that I liked and then it came out of Photography came out of just like a lack of finding something that I really really really wanted to do every single job that I had It was just like oh, it was a job.

I had to wake up and thinking. Oh, I have to go to work today Mm hmm. And so then with photography. I just kind of like came to me one day where I was like Okay I like photography. I really liked interior design, but I didn't want to go back to school for interior design because I didn't know whether or not I was actually going to be good at it.

so yeah, I then thought, okay, well...

I like architecture stuff or whatever and I like photography and then it just kind of I always used to look at Like new houses that would come online I really like just looking at potential houses that I could buy just looking into the future dreaming, you know And then I [00:15:00] was looking at some photos and I thought oh some of these photos are really well done And some of them are really crappy And then I thought I wonder if people do this for work if there's actual like just straight up real estate Photographers and like architectural stuff that wasn't like Just shooting architecture for real estate and magazines or sorry, not for like for magazines and for print and stuff like that.

I wanted it specifically for real estate. Um, and then I called up one of my buddies, Cam Walker who's a real estate agent and he's a close buddy of mine. And I said, do you have a guy that you work with that does specifically does real estate stuff? And he was like, Oh yeah, we do. Like. He works for us all the time and does all of my stuff.

I'm like, that's what I want to do. And so I just sort of followed that path and then ended up doing what I do now. And it just like snowballed into this, this career that I have now. And, um, yeah, and I've loved it ever since. Like, it's been such a good job. There's never been a day where I've woken up thinking like, Oh, I have to go to work today.

Like the classic, yeah, sure. It's a Monday and [00:16:00] whatever, but it's never like. Oh, I hate my job, and I don't want to do this, and I need to find something else. Wow, good for you. Yeah, it's been good. I'm happy that I found that. And it

sounds like that time when you were bouncing around between a lot of different jobs, and doing jobs that you didn't love, was really valuable in learning what you didn't

want to do.

Yeah, totally. That's exactly what it was. It was really just like, I do something, and I'm like, Nope, that's not what I want. I need to find something else. Yeah, I went through so many different things, but I'm so happy that this has landed and it's, you know, I've been doing it for, I started in 2014, so it's been almost 10 years.

Yeah, congratulations. Yeah, there hasn't been a day where I'm just like, I need to find something else. So, that's

fantastic. And that same kind of idea of figuring out what you don't like and being okay with that reminds me of something we were chatting about on our ride. You were talking about like, you're like, yeah, I don't pedal.

I just don't like it. I just hate pedaling. Yeah.

I just like shuttling. Yeah. I said that to Steve when I got into biking. I was like, I'm not, I'm not pedaling. That's not going to be something that I'm going to like. I was like, I'm going to shuttle through and through. But [00:17:00] when I have to pedal, I will


You did a good job today. But yeah, I think that's okay. If people don't like paddling, they've got easy access to shuttling, like you've got on the North Shore, it's like, why not? Yeah, totally. Make the sport, you know, like the parts of the sport that you like and you don't have to force any of the other parts.

Exactly, yeah. Very true. So, going back to the photography, like for me, Looking on your website when I was doing some research. It's a great website by the way. I see like two very different kind of striking opposites We've got the architectural photography the real estate stuff these kind of stark white modern houses Yeah, and then we've got all the mountain bike filmmaking and photography this deep green beautiful forest.

Yeah, they seem like direct opposites Yeah, like I wanted to ask like how for you do the two kind of balance each other out or complement each

other Yeah, I think that um I mean, they balance each other out in the sense that, um, I don't get bored of either of them because I'm switching it up so often. Um, [00:18:00] my...

Everyone who works in, you know, my, my real estate clients and then my mountain biking clients, they are always shocked that I do each the, the opposite because I'll be like, you know, on a real estate shoot and they're like, Oh, what else do you do? Or do you just do this? And I'm like, Oh no, I actually do a lot of mountain biking video and photo.

And they're like, what? Oh, that's so crazy. That's so different than this. And then same thing with mountain biking. I'm like, no, I do a lot of real estate stuff. They're like, that's so like corporate. I'm like, yeah, it's. It's a good balance because I don't get burned out of either side, which is nice. So, you know, when I feel like the.

Mountain biking stuff takes a lot of, um, takes a lot of brain power, takes a lot of like creativity and, and energy, you know, getting to the trails and making sure you have the right equipment and everything. And so I feel like if I did that full time, then it would burn me out really quickly. And I've had seasons where it does and I'm like, okay, I need to, you know, scale back on this a little bit because I feel like I'm creatively like really dying here.

And then [00:19:00] the real estate stuff is just like, it's good to have because. I just, I don't ever, um, feel like I'm exerting too much energy, I'm not, you know, creative wise, it's almost just like a template that I follow for every shoot, which is, you know, it's consistent, it's good, um, you know, I, I can create my own schedule, if I want to work seven days a week, I can, if I want to work zero days a week, I can, so it's, it's good, and I've got good clients, so they're, they're all So nice to work with and it's a good balance.

I really like it So and it just kind of like ebbs and flows with the seasons and stuff, you know with the mountain biking season Ramping up then sometimes the real estate will kind of die off So then I just put more energy into mountain biking and then vice versa with the real estate So it's kind of a nice little balance that I have that I never thought that I would have but I

do so That's so awesome.

Good on you for going after it. Yeah, and I'm curious, like, is there anything you've learnt from the architectural photography, the real estate stuff, that has then helped you when you go back into, like, making your next mountain bike [00:20:00] film?

Yeah, I think so. I think that just comes with, like, just knowing how to use your camera equipment, to be honest.

It's just like, yeah, I don't know, just like, Certain, certain styles, like you can be a little bit more creative with the real estate stuff because you've had to be more creative with the mountain biking stuff. Um, just with like, even, um, I'll throw in some like mountain biking shots that I've gotten of Steve into the real estate stuff like because people are like Oh, yeah, we're listening this house in Lynn Valley We want to show that it's close to the trails and everything and they're like, do you have any like mountain biking stuff?

We can throw in there. I'm like, yeah Yeah, so that's kind of like spilled over a little bit, which is cool. And then The cool thing was is that the when I got into the real estate stuff I wasn't doing any of the mountain bike stuff professionally. It was only until I would like I used my business for real estate to get more equipment and gain more skills.

And then I would, Steve and I would [00:21:00] just go out and we'd be like, Oh, I got a new lens. Let's go out and like do some photos for fun. And at this point, Steve wasn't sponsored. So it was just for Instagram, for YouTube, whatever. And we would just go out and get some fun photos. And, but they would all be really good because, you know, I knew what I was doing, but we were just out having fun.

So then it just kind of like. you know, I got better and I got more equipment. So then we went out and did more shoots and stuff like that. So then his, um, sponsors kind of came out of the woodwork just because all of his stuff on his instagram was Super well done. And people were like, Oh, why does Steve always have really good photos and everything, but he's not sponsored or anything.

So how is he like getting all this stuff done? And it's like, well, he's an in house photographer, videographer. So we just go out for fun. Like, you know, it's hard to find a photographer to go out and, you know, pay their day rate and stuff just for fun photos. Not a lot of people do that. So for him, it just kind of benefited him.

And now it benefited me because now I get called by his sponsors to go do other riders and, you know, campaign stuff for their catalogs and whatever. [00:22:00] Just because, yeah, we're so used to going out and just having fun and getting

shots. Yeah, it's so cool to hear how you've worked together and it started from fun, it's still fun.

Yeah. And now it's blossomed into, like, yeah, some pretty amazing stuff for both of you. Yeah, yeah, I know. I'd love to, to hear about Dirt Diaries. Oh, yeah. Yeah, like, won the, the Crankworx competition this year. Yeah, Yeah.

Yeah, it struck me like super creative concept. Yeah, I'd love to know like yeah Maybe tell us a little bit about the film the concept and then like what was your why behind that film? Yeah, who were you aiming to

inspire? Yeah, the concept honestly came to me just one night I was just laying in bed thinking about you know The next video that we were gonna do this had nothing to do with Dirt Diaries It was really just like, uh, you know, in the future, we'll do a video and, um, we'll just try and come up with a concept.

And then, I don't know, I think it was just like, it just came to me [00:23:00] within like, you know, 15 minutes of falling asleep. I was like, oh, I think this would be really cool if we have, you know, a kid, um, just kind of like procrastinating or just kind of, you know, like going off and, and thinking about. You know, riding his bike or whatever, um, and he just had one of his little toy bikes and whatever because Um, I have a nephew who's six and you know He's always running his little cars around and his little things so it could have gotten inspiration from him.

I don't know Um, but honestly, yeah within 15 minutes I had the concept and I knew all of the features that I wanted to have like I had all of the little like Things I wanted the bike to go off of in the garage all the little things and I was like Oh, and then it could snap to Steve doing this in the trail and whatever and then I remember I think Steve was working night Shift and he came home and I was like, I have a concept for a video.

It's so good I think that this is like I want to go full pull into filming this and I like laid it out for him He was like, that's so good He's like, I love that and then we sat on it a little bit longer and then that was when Last year, [00:24:00] um, I wanted to do Dirt Diaries, but I couldn't because I had, like, a scheduling conflict, and so I couldn't do it, and then, so it was kind of in our minds, and I was like, honestly, if we do get asked to do Dirt Diaries, I'll do this video, but if we don't get asked, then we're gonna do it regardless, um, cause my biggest fear was getting asked to do Dirt Diaries and then not having a concept whatsoever.

And so, because I'm just like, I don't want to have to like, pull a concept out of my ass and have it not be good. And so, yeah, we had this concept and I was like, okay, perfect, we'll do this, we'll start filming, whatever. And then we just kind of elaborated on it, but like, immediately we knew our neighbor, Wes, he was going to be in it.

Because he's just like the coolest kid ever and so I was like yeah Wes is gonna be the kid and this is how it's all gonna lay out and I had all the shots planned out and so As soon as we got the go ahead to be like, okay This is the first day you can film we were out we and we went to Kamloops that first day Well, and we just started filming it and everything just kind of like fell into place and yeah, it worked out So well, like we everything went so well for that video that I don't know if another video is going to go that good.[00:25:00]

Like, we had perfect weather and everything.

It was, yeah, it was good. I loved, yeah, just the creativity. Like, there's a scene in there where the kid knocks over a climber's chalk bag. Yeah. And there's like this puff of, of fog. Yeah, that shot took so many times. And then it cuts to Steve, like, jumping through the


Yeah, that was a concept that I, I thought of. Um, it was just like, I thought... At first, I was thinking, okay, how can I make this happen? I think, because we get so many foggy days. I was like, how can I make this actually work? And I was thinking that it was going to be like a bag of flour or something that was going to drop first.

Um, but then I was like, why would you have a bag of flour in the garage? And then I was like, okay, no, what else will do that? And then I was like, oh, a chalk bag, chalk bag will be good. But then, oh my gosh, it was me, Wes, and his dad, Matt. We were in the garage and that took us... I don't know, probably an hour to shoot just that one scene because we needed the bag to drop perfectly and we needed the chalk to come out of the bag perfectly the way that I wanted it to, but it wasn't coming out.

So then it ended up having to be, I, we had [00:26:00] to drop the bag, had to drop the bag in one scene and then, um, the next scene was Wes. He had to hit the bag and then the, like. Plume would come out and then we had to shoot him going through so like it was just this whole like different cut cut cut of Him like hitting the bag and then I'd get that shot and then I was like, okay Grab the bike and put it through and it took us so long and it was and then I remember We shot it all and then I was like, oh the Chalk's not really like showing up And then it was because I was facing out of the garage and so it was like super light as a background I was like, oh crap, that's not gonna work so then we had to do the whole thing over again because I had to shoot into the darkness and It's just, yeah, things that you just have to learn, like, it's just trial by

error, honestly.

Yeah, do you ever get frustrated, like, during the process when stuff's taking a long time? You're managing kids, babies, people helping you out, kind

of thing? Yeah, sometimes, but not too much. Like, I definitely kind of like, give... I don't know, I give myself a lot of room to have things go wrong or take a long time, [00:27:00] but I also, um...

I don't know, I don't really get frustrated if things don't work out. I only kind of get frustrated if it's not working the way that I want it to. Like, if it's, you know, if I had this concept in my mind and it's not really, like, panning out the way I do, then I really, like, internalize it. And I'm like, oh, I'm a bad filmer.

Or like, I can't make this happen because I don't have the skills to make it happen. And then I just kind of, like, really start to self doubt. And I'm like, oh, if I was, you know, better at my job, then things would have gone a bit better for this. Honestly, it's just, you gotta do your best, and you gotta try and make it work, and, and it worked.

Totally. Yeah, I think we all get caught up in some of that. It's kind of self doubt and negative self talk sometimes. Oh, yeah. I'm super into myself. On the bike or in other pursuits. Yeah. Do you have any, any tools or anything, like, that you'll use from your, your rational mind, perhaps after a situation like that, that you'll use to, to get back to work or to get back to riding?

Um, yeah, I don't know. I just kind of, I'm like, well, I'm only going to get better if I, [00:28:00] if I keep trying and if I just keep learning, like I'm never going to get better if I'm just like, okay, well, that's my skill level and I'm just going to stick to it. Um, so I'm always just like, like I said earlier, I'm just like, I just say yes to things just because I'm like, yeah, you know, it's, it's easy to be in your comfort zone, but it's also, yeah, you don't learn or progress or anything if you don't go outside of it.

Um, and like doing Dirt Diaries was a huge step out of the comfort zone. Like, I was so nervous to do that because I was like, Oh my God, everyone is going to watch this video. And it's front of, in front of thousands and thousands of people. And everyone's going to be judging me. And I'm, you know, I'm, I'm not as skilled as these other videographers and whatever.

And so I really, yeah, I really got like self conscious about that. But I don't know, it just, it. It ended up, the final product was so good that I was like, okay, yeah, no, like, I actually have confidence in what we do. And Steve and I will still watch it even before it got released. We watched it and we were like, oh my god, like, I can't believe that just the [00:29:00] two of us produced this.

Like, we did this and it was just us and it was, you know, he, like, He did so much work for that video as well, like I work with Steve so well because he will help me so much and like coming up with a bunch of shot ideas and angles and like he, he'll, he'll talk to me about what he thinks the best angle is for the feature that he's doing and the trick that he's doing and everything.

So like we feed off a lot of each other with that kind of stuff. So I do rely on him for a lot of, um, you know, knowledge when it comes to. Angles for filming and stuff because he's grown up his entire life watching bike videos. So I just, I trust his knowledge on that. So I feel like I've progressed so much just because of him.

Like if it was, if I got into it just by myself, I wouldn't be where I was. If it wasn't for him, to be honest, like he just has so much knowledge of the bike industry and how bike video should look and sound and, and everything that it's just, I've [00:30:00] learned everything from him, but. In the sense that he knows nothing about like camera equipment or video stuff or editing or whatever.

It's all just come from how he wants a video to look on screen and like what the final product is. And then I just fill in the blanks of how to make that work.

But Yeah, it's the perfect synergy. You hit the nail on the head with that film. Oh, yeah. Thanks. It's the perfect mix of like, watching gnarly features in this beautiful slow motion and there's humor involved.

I just yeah. And this storyline as well. Yeah. Yeah. I wanted to ask like you you mentioned You got this crazy like creative idea and you're like we have to do it. These are the features These are the people I want in it. Mm hmm How do you then go about being like, okay Steve You're gonna have to ride this stuff again.

I know you've had like a bit of a tough year coming back from injuries. Yeah. Concussion and stuff like this. Mm hmm. What's it like for you being like, hey, Steve, do you mind riding that stuff again?

Totally, yeah. I mean, it was, uh, it wasn't my intention necessarily for [00:31:00] him to, like, ride the feature that he crashed on so aggressively the year before.

Um, I was not planning on him riding that ever again. He said that he wasn't going to ride it ever again. So, like, the concept wasn't for him to ride that feature specifically. Um, The concept was to ride just like gnarly stuff, you know, that would look good on screen, but I didn't really have like, I didn't have specific features in mind.

I just was like, Oh, it'd be cool. Like, you know, if he's, if the kid is, you know, on the Hot Wheels track, like I was, I had, I'm like, Oh yeah, the Whistler A line berms and, and all that kind of stuff. I didn't have like, I was like, Oh yeah, like a skinny rock slab. That'll be good. But it wasn't specific things.

I just leave that up to Steve. Like I just tell him I want this. And then he comes up with the feature. Um, because I don't know, like it, that's, it's on him. I don't ever tell him what he should ride. It's always just like, if you want to ride something like this, pick a feature that you're comfortable with.

So then it just all kind of fell into place as soon as I told him what I wanted and how I wanted it to relate to the features [00:32:00] that the kid was riding with his bike and he just had them all, okay, I'll do this and I'll do that and I'll do this. Um, and then it was, I don't know at what point it was when he decided that he was going to ride that feature again.

Um, the one that he crashed on. And, but he was like, yeah, I think it'll be good. Like a good way to round out the video because he's being like forced to ride all this stuff. It'll be a really good concept in the video if the kid is like, okay, we're going back to the feature that Steve died on. He's going to do it again because this kid doesn't care.

It's in his imagination. Like, you know, whatever. But he was like, Steve got, you know, his confidence back up again. He's like, no, like, I feel really good about this. I'm strong on my bike again. And I don't want to end on a bad note with this feature. He's like, I've written it so many times. He had so many hits under his belt.

So he's like, I'm not going to let that one hit. just be the end. So then he was like, okay, I know I'll hit it and it'll be a good thing. And he hit a great and it was totally fine. But I was, I was nervous. Like it was, [00:33:00] that was the one time where I was actually just kind of like shaking as I was holding the camera and I was like, Oh no, this isn't gonna be good.

And I was like holding my breath because I was there when he crashed and it was awful and it was the worst crash that he had ever had. And I just didn't want to witness that again. But because he was so confident in hitting it and he was, you know, riding it correctly and properly and smooth and.

Whatever, then I was just like, okay, he'll be fine, he'll be fine. But, yeah, and luckily it worked out, and the concept was good in the video, so. Yeah.

I'd love to dive into that a little bit more. You mentioned that usually you're not nervous when you're shooting Steve, because you know that he knows what he's doing. He's confident. Can you sense if he's ever like a little bit unsure about a feature, but he's telling you like, oh, don't

worry, I'm a hundred percent.

Yep. Yeah, no, I know exactly when he is nervous and when he is not. And, um, I, I just don't say anything like, it's, it's up to him whether or not he wants to ride the feature. Me saying anything to him isn't gonna help me. Telling him that I'm nervous isn't gonna help. [00:34:00] I, I won't tell him, you've got it.

You're good. Whatever. Because if I'm saying that, and he's not. Wanting to do the feature, then he's going to hit it. He's not going to be confident and then something bad is going to happen. So I just let him figure out his emotions. And if he wants to hit it, he does it. And if he doesn't, then he doesn't.

So it, it doesn't matter to me. Um, But I, yeah, I'm, I'm nervous when he hits certain things because I am the type of person to think worst case scenario and I'm never like, Oh, it'll be fine. It'll be fine. I always think like, Oh yeah, like when I'm on my bike, even I'm like, Oh yeah, like I could go offline. I could crash off this rock or I can go off this drop and not do it properly.

Like it's just something I can't control. And, um, so yeah, I think about that with him, but a little bit less like, you know, he's had so many successes. When he rides features that I'm like cool his success rate is way higher than his crash rate So I trust him when he rides certain features but I just also think like When we're [00:35:00] filming specifically he has his job and it's to ride the feature properly I have my job and it's to get that on film perfectly the first time so that he doesn't have to do it again So because I'm so focused on my job, then it kind of takes my brain off of what he's supposed to be doing.

So I'm just kind of like, Kate, I'm nervous for me, because I'm like, okay, I better get the shot, I better get the shot. And so I'm so focused that it just kind of takes away that worry a bit on him. So it's kind of nice. He likes it because he's not, you know, thinking that I'm down there being like, Oh my god, I hope he's okay, and I hope he doesn't crash and whatever.

So it kind of works out for the both of

us. Yeah, I love that. way of kind of using the task at hand or the job at hand as a way to kind of refocus and perhaps deal with any nerves you

have. Yeah. Yeah. It really just does kind of calm my nerves. Cause I'm like, okay, I'm rolling, my batteries are charged.

I've got this, my triposit, that was rolling. That's good. And then by the time I'm like, okay, go, I'm like, okay, I've got that angle, this I'm following, I'm tracking, I'm, I'm focusing, I'm doing whatever. So, you know, it's, it's [00:36:00] really like when he does the feature, then it's like silence. And there's no sellies, and then I like, it hit stop, and then we're like, Yay!

So it's always just so funny, there's such a delay in like, You know, excitement when he does a really crazy feature, Because we're just so focused on getting the shot properly, That it, there's always, it's, it's really funny to watch our stuff back, When you're on the outside of it, and it's just like, Oh yeah, he just did this insane feature, And it's just silence.

Is there a

lot of energy? Like when you finally hit stop and you're like,

yeah, yeah, yeah. If it's like a crazy feature that he's done, then it's like, oh my God. Yeah.

you've obviously done so much work with Steve now over the years. You've been working with Wade, with Brett Tippie, with Yoann and a host of these, these high performing athletes. Yeah. Um, and doing like some riding yourself. At the same time, like, what have you learned from working with these guys, seeing how they operate, and girls, I should say.

Seeing how they operate, is there any kind of tools or strategies that you've been like, ha, I'm gonna try that in my own riding. [00:37:00]

To be honest, I don't know. I've just learned, like, Um, I mean with, with the girls that I've been with, like, I don't know, the guys are just like, yeah, I learned like how to ride better.

Like everyone has good riding tips and stuff to be stronger on the bike or how to do this and how to do that. So like I try and take tips from who I can. Um, but uh, yeah, I don't know. It's always like the girls inspire me a lot just because I don't know, everyone's just like so happy to be out with everybody and everyone's got like really good tips.

for you, but like not in a like, I'm better than you and here's a tip to, you know, ride better. Everyone's just like, yeah, like it, you know, if you want to learn something, I'm happy to help. And if you don't, then you, whatever, it doesn't matter. Let's just go ride what you're comfortable with or whatever.

But, um, yeah, no, it's just the riding community has just been so good regardless. Just everyone's out specifically just to have a good time. And that's like the only reason why [00:38:00] I'm into it is because I just wanted to get into. summer sport that kind of gave me that same like endorphin boost that snowboarding did.

Like, I was just missing a sport that, you know, got me out with my friends. And at the end of the day, we were just like having such a blast. You're just like laughing so hard or, you know, laughing so hard. You're crying just because you've done something stupid or you thought something was super, super cool.

And then you look back at the footage and it was super lame. And I don't know, just like, everyone's just taught me to just have a really good time. And also like, I guess a lot of people, Um, we'll have like good advice on when you're not feeling good on the bike, then to not take it personally. Like if you're not feeling good, then just either don't go for a ride if you're not feeling it, or you know, push yourself and get back on the bike and just do something that's like super chill, just to like get a fun ride underneath your belt or anything.

But yeah, I don't know. There's been lots of little good tips and stuff that everyone has taught me over the years, but

yeah, I bet it's amazing. Just soaking up the aura of some of these athletes you're working [00:39:00] with.

It is, it is cool. It's, it's funny to be like with because Steve was so into biking and I wasn't at all, then, you know, Steve will just tell me like who these people are that we're with and like what their background is and, you know, what kind of rider they are, what they've done in the past and everything.

And I'm like, cool. I'm like, I have no idea who these people are. I don't know. And so then, you know, I'll get a gig to go work with somebody. You. And then I'm like, Oh, yeah, I gotta go. I'm gonna go shoot with this person. And Steve's like, That's insane. I can't believe you're gonna go and shoot this. He's like, You know, I've watched their stuff for years or whatever.

And I'm like, Cool. Yeah, I'm just gonna go do that. And they're like, Do you even know who this is? I'm like, Kinda. I'm like, I don't know. Yeah, I just, you know, people are people. Everyone's cool. I just, yeah, everyone's been super good to work with.

Do you find that helps you kind of approach shoots without any like expectation of what it's gonna be like or perhaps pressure?

Yeah, probably. It's just another

rider. It's just another rider. It's just another [00:40:00] person. They're self conscious. I'm self conscious. It is what it is. Like, you know, everyone's got their skills and... Yeah, I just kind of, I go into things with zero ego whatsoever. And I'm always the first person to be like, if I don't know something, I'm like, yeah, I don't know that.

Like, if, if I do something wrong, I'm like, oh, sorry, I, I don't know. Like, that was just a mistake I made. I don't care. It's, and I don't know, I think that's probably worked to my benefit just because I, I don't care. I don't ever want to go into something being like, oh yeah, I know what I'm doing. And you know, I'm not going to mess up or whatever.

It's just, it's not a good way of being. I feel like it's just, yeah. Not me. So it's, it's been good. So, yeah. Yeah,

it's been nice. That's a good attitude. We'll kind of chat in about that on our pedal up, won't we? And kind of say, it's so contrary often if we're like, try to pretend we know everything, then we'll like, be so stiff and shaky that we'll...

That's something or forget how to explain something to someone. Whereas if we're just honest, we'll be more relaxed and usually that works [00:41:00]

better as a result. Yeah, I know. Like if I get really, if I'm meeting somebody who's like a super pro at something or whatever, then I'll, you know, I feel like I'll get really nervous if they're asking me a question.

That of something that I already know how to do, but because I'm nervous, then I'm just like, Oh, I, uh, I'll give them this weird answer because I'm trying not to sound like an idiot. And then I'm like, Oh my God, why did I say that? That was such a simple question. If I wasn't like overthinking it, I could have just answered it properly.

And then, cause I know what I'm talking about, but it's just because I'm, I always have that imposter syndrome of like, Oh, there's such a good filmer. There's such a photographer, such a good photographer or whatever. And so I don't want to come off sounding like an idiot. Meanwhile, it's like, oh, no, they were just asking me a super legit, like, easy question.

But because I was overthinking it and whatever, then I just said something super stupid. So I'm just like, no, just don't try and be anything you're not trying to be. So it's just like, if you don't know it, just whatever you don't know it and just go into it, chill and it'll be fine. It'll be

better. Wise words there.

Yeah. Do you ever find it tricky, like, getting into [00:42:00] some of these places? Perhaps a certain rider wants to shoot on a certain feature. But it's down like a double black trail or some off map free riding stuff. Yeah, yeah. How do you navigate

that? Um, I feel like I've, I feel like I've been in those situations but I probably just blocked them out of my mind.

But I'm very upfront with people. I say, you know, this is my skill level and this is what I'm, like, able to work within. Um, but I always just try and make it work and I will, you know, if it's on a trail that's like really hard to do, then I'll just be like, I'll make it work, but I'll like hike up the trail and I'll meet you guys or whatever, because, um, yeah, it'll be like a lot more work for me to get my bike down it or something, but I'm very upfront with my skill level and if I can't do something, I'll be like, yeah, I don't know how I'm going to be able to make it down that trail.

But. To be honest, most of the time when we're filming, I'm hiking. Like, I think we learned that early on with Steve and I. It was just more of a hassle to bring my bike with me. Um, because it was just like, I need to keep my camera equipment out. And if I have to [00:43:00] put it away every single time to get on my bike to ride a little bit further, it's such a waste of time.

So I'm constantly just hiking my, my gear in. If it's like going up the top and hiking down or starting at the bottom and hiking up. Um, and then, yeah, it's up to the rider if they want to start from the top and meet me, or if they just want to hype up with their bike the entire way. It's, it just depends on what you're shooting.

But, I mean, I don't think I've really gotten into too many situations where I'm like, Oh crap, I'm really... Left here. Yeah, totally. That's a good thing. Yeah, it is good. I'm happy. I haven't really been in that position that I remember. Anyways,

I wanted to ask, uh, like looking through the lens. What's your perspective or thoughts on this idea of like camera courage?

When someone's riding their bike behind a camera.

Oh, I see like, yeah, they're like hitting it because the camera's filming them. Yeah,

um or feeling like they need to hit it or show up in a certain way.

Yeah Um, I feel like there's always gonna be that. when things are filming. I mean, yeah, [00:44:00] you know, Steve has it kind of, but not really.

Like, I mean, maybe in the beginning, I don't know. I feel like just maybe because we've been filming for so long and for so long we were filming without pressure, then I think that that just never got to him because we, he's just always had a camera on him and it's always never been pressure. Um, so I think he's just gotten used to it.

Um, but also, I mean, Steve's so good, and he picks the stuff that he can ride, so I don't think he's ever really come across like, oh crap, you know, the camera's rolling, I have to hit this thing, or whatever, like, everything that we film is stuff he's comfortable on. So, um, he, he doesn't really have that as much, but I'm sure that there are people that do have it.


but... I'm curious, what was it like today? We kind of flipped the roles. I was filming you as we rode down Half Nelson. I was like, uh, I don't

know if you're going to get a good video out of this. This is going to be pretty

slow. But it was a fun ride, so.

I let go of it pretty early. I was like, you know what?

I don't care. You can use whatever you want to use. Okay. Yeah. I don't, I don't tell people by any means that I'm a good rider, so. [00:45:00] Yeah, I, I

don't really care. So kind of using that same means of like reduce the pressure. Yeah,

yeah. But also my career doesn't depend on whether or not I'm a good biker, right?

Like my sponsorships don't, it doesn't matter. So I can only imagine for, you know, the riders that I'm filming, they're like, okay, cool. Like I have to hit this feature because my job relies on it and my career and everything. So that would be an insane amount of pressure to have. Um, and I'm, I'm happy that I don't have that.

Yeah, absolutely. I have it in the sense of like, My career depends on whether or not I get this shot properly. So that stresses me out. Like that's a huge stress of mine. Is that someone's risking their life to, um, hit this feature. And if I don't record it, if they're planning on only doing this one time, then I only have one shot to do it.

And that is a lot of pressure. Um, luckily, yeah, it, it has worked out. Um, I feel like there. may have been times where it's just like, Oh yeah, no, it didn't work. Or if ideally, if you can get in another shop and that would be great. But, um, and then [00:46:00] we'll go and do another shop. But yeah, that is a lot of pressure because there's a lot of high, high consequence stuff that I've

felt over the years.

What are some tools that you've learned over the years to perhaps to help manage some of that pressure?

Um, I don't know, just like Making sure that everything's just like, checked off. It's like, just like a checklist in my brain. Just, you know, there's enough space on the memory card, my batteries are charged, I'm focused, and I'm like, you know, you track the shot a bunch of times, just practicing.

Making sure, okay, they're gonna start here, they're gonna end here. And then just to try and not make it more complicated than it needs to be. Like, there's a lot of things where... If it is a really high consequence feature, um, I feel like we've learned to not get fancy with the shot because it's really hard to, um, you know, nail the focus and nail the tracking and where the rider's gonna be in the frame.

Um, it's really just smart to set up your camera in just sort of like a wider set shot, um, that you don't have to worry about pulling focus or tracking properly or whatever. Um, just set it [00:47:00] up so that it's like really cinematically nice. Um, but that you're going to get the shot regardless because that's the last thing that you want.

I'd rather have a more, you know, static, beautiful shot versus like a really artsy shot, but you have the risk of, you know, not getting it. Totally.

Yeah. Yeah.

I think that that's probably something that we've learned over the

years. Yeah. It's so cool to hear all the, all the lessons that come with like, like 10 years of lived experience doing it now.


have you ever been given any really good advice from a mentor? Um, that's kind of stuck around in your mind, either for biking, snowboarding, photography.


good advice from a mentor.

Steve's a huge mentor to me just in, he's just such a wealth of knowledge with. Like I said earlier, like, he's just watched every single mountain bike video ever made.

I, I listen to everything that Steve has to say. I take his opinion. Every time over anybody else. It's just like, um, I don't know.

Yeah, [00:48:00] he's, he's just really good to listen to. He's always got a lot of ideas. He's really creative, um, when it comes to shots and stuff like that and what he wants to see. So, um, yeah, I take a lot of advice from him and then, um, yeah, just like little things here and there. When I meet somebody new, who's, yeah, someone that I look up to in the photography or video world and, um, just taking little things here and there, but I don't know.

I don't, I don't know anything specific. It'll probably come to me on my way home, to be honest, but yeah, nothing, nothing too crazy or

specific. Oh good, we're gonna start, yeah, start winding things down here, but there's one thing that I wanted to touch on we talked about on our ride. Yeah. Um, you mentioned another thing that you perhaps into a little bit more in the past was cliff jumping.

So you kind of, I guess, doing that locally in the Lynn Canyon, I'm guessing, and going down on trips to Hawaii and doing all this amazing cliff jumping. We're talking about the idea of kind of like fear and you mentioned that you're Scared of heights, but you're also into cliff jumping. So I wanted to unpack that subject a little bit.

Oh my God. Yeah. Tell us about that. Yeah.

I think, [00:49:00] um, yeah, growing up, I kinda, I was like kind of into cliff jumping, um, when I was younger, just like Lynn Canyon kind of stuff. I did gymnastics for a little bit. So I like kind of had that as a background. Um, and then, so my friends and I would just go practice our backflips and stuff into the Canyon.

Um, and then, yeah, Steve and I got more and more into it just with like going to Hawaii. And stuff. Um, it was just something that we like to go do. And then we made friends who lived in Hawaii. And so we got to go around with them and do a bunch of stuff over there. And then, um, it just, we spent so many years going to Lions Bay.

And we would just, like, every single summer day that was hot, we would go after work and on the weekends. And we spent so much time there. And it was just so fun. Um, but it was like, yeah, I do have an insane fear of heights. And it. It's a lot of stuff in my life is always kind of driven just with like, you know, just trying to keep up.

I'm always just trying to like keep up with the guys and because it's, it's [00:50:00] fun, like it's fun what they do. And none of my girlfriends did any stuff like that. So it was just, you know, I had a lot of fun doing what the guys did. And so I was just pushing myself like, okay, they're going to do this cliff jump.

I'm going to do this cliff jump. And I just kind of like, and even with snowboarding and biking and stuff like that, I just, I don't know. I always just wanted to go and hang out with them. I feel like. I would have been, if I had an older brother, I would have been the, the kid that was always following my older brother, trying to do what he does, did, and so I guess I kind of just channeled that into Steve, like, he was just so fun to hang out with, so I just followed him everywhere and did whatever he did, so, we, I would just like push through that like fear of like, oh my god, I'm on a cliff, and it's super high, and I'm gonna do this thing, but, the, like I was saying earlier, the success of actually like doing the trick, Just completely took over the fear of heights in the first place and it was just like oh my god That was so fun.

And it was so worth it and I have to do it again And then and the next thing I knew I was gainering 60 foot cliffs in Costa Rica and it was yeah It was cool. We went we did a [00:51:00] full Costa Rica trip We just met a bunch of people on social media became friends with them and we went down There and did this whole like cliff jumping adventure tour and whatever and that was just this This weird little chunk of our lives, and um, now we're old and rickety, and so now we just kind of stick to chillin on the beach.

And Steve uses all of his energy and motion to just go into mountain biking. And yeah, that was just, it was a fun little... Section

of our lives there. Totally. Yeah. It sounds like such a cool experience. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm curious, like those learnings you take out of this cliff jumping phase, working with your fear of heights there.

Is there anything that you've perhaps taken and channeled into mountain biking or snowboarding and pushing through barriers there? Yeah,

probably. Yeah, probably. It's just. It's like, you know, like I said, it, it feels really good when you've like successfully ticked off a feature or done something that you never thought that you said that you were going to be able to do.

Like never in my life would I have thought that I was actually going to be able to like do a gainer off a cliff, [00:52:00] um, with cliff jumping. Like that was just, I always thought it was the coolest trick to ever do. And when I, I was just like, you know what, I'm sick of backflipping. I really want to learn how to gainer.

And I, yeah, just taught myself with all my friends. Um, and, and I just loved that feeling. And so then it just kind of like in mountain biking, you know, I look at some of these things that when I first got into mountain biking, I was like, Oh, I'm never going to do that. I'm never going to do that. And now I'm able to do these things because I've pushed past that fear.

And because Steve has coached me so well. Um, because he's like, no, this is how you, body positioning should be and your, your bike and how to use your brakes and everything. He's just like taught me everything that I need to know to successfully do a feature without dying. Um, and it feels good because then you can look back and be like, holy crap, I can't believe that I did that feature.

And it just feels way better than saying no to something because you weren't willing to try. So, yeah.

Yeah, that's an awesome backstory. I love that. If you could give people one little bit of advice, uh, people that are perhaps [00:53:00] looking to, to find or create a career that's in line with their passions, uh, like what you've done, what would it be?

Um, yeah, I don't know. I would just say to just like try, try doing something that you like to do. Like, don't be afraid to fail at it. But I mean, if you found something that you like to do. Then, yeah, just don't be afraid to actually, you know, take that step and, and give it a go. Cause, that's exactly what I did.

I thought that I was just gonna end up being, you know, doing this regular whatever job, not liking my job at all. I was just gonna do it because it was secure and I made money and I could do it for the rest of my life or whatever. But I just, I wasn't okay with that. And so yeah, I just took that leap and was like, no, I'm going to try and do this.

And if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't. And I'm so happy that I did. Um, and I'm shocked at myself that I actually do this for work because it's something that I've wanted to do since I was a kid. And I've always talked about like, oh, it'd be so cool to [00:54:00] be a videographer or whatever and, and film these videos.

And I just, yeah, I'm stoked with myself that I have actually gotten to that point where I'm like, no. You know, working with some of the biggest names and the biggest company or production companies in, you know, mountain biking and snowboarding history, just because, yeah, I wasn't afraid to say yes to being out of my comfort zone.


yeah, good on you for having the courage to take those first steps. It's amazing to see where it's led you. Yeah.

And also just to be like, yeah, don't be scared to look like an idiot. Like to, you know, I'm not afraid to look like an idiot and whatever. If I don't know what I'm doing, then I'm the first to say, I don't know what I'm doing.

And people appreciate that. So I think that's a good way of being, don't have an ego

and you'll go really far. You've got it. Yeah. Words of wisdom right there. And where can people find you online, follow along your adventures and your filmmaking projects? Totally.

Yeah. Uh, Instagram, just at Toevs is, is my Instagram stuff on YouTube.

I'm trying to [00:55:00] get better at posting my videos on my YouTube page, but basically everything that I've done is on Steve's. So just look up Steve. You'll find all of my stuff on there too. But yeah, I'm really trying to get better at putting my stuff on my website and everything and even Instagram I'm like not even that great at posting.

I'll post something like once every couple of months Sometimes I'll only post a couple things a year just because I don't know. I just I can't be bothered I can't get around to it, but Steve's good at posting So everyone could just follow him and they'll

see all of my stuff as long as it makes its way on there somehow Yeah.

Fantastic. Well, thanks so much for coming and being a part of this podcast. Thanks for having me. It's been fantastic hanging out with you, um, learning a little bit more about what you do. Totally. Yeah.

No, this has been a great experience. I'm happy to actually have said yes to it.

Fantastic. Face your fears.

What's up guys, just one more thing before you hit the trails. If you enjoyed this podcast, please be sure to subscribe and don't be a stranger. I'd love to hear from you about any topics or any particular episodes that you enjoyed, [00:56:00] and even about any guests that you'd like to hear me have on the show in the future.

You can find me on Instagram at The underscore Mind underscore Mountain. This podcast, mountain biking, and mindset are all things that are very close to my heart, so I feel super grateful to be able to share these conversations with you. So much love to you all for taking the time to listen, and I'll see you next time.



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